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	<title>Comments on: Can Search be a Utility?</title>
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	<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/</link>
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		<title>By: Traditional Enterprise Search Meets E2.0 &#171; Word of Pie</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-2147</link>
		<dc:creator>Traditional Enterprise Search Meets E2.0 &#171; Word of Pie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 23:24:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-2147</guid>
		<description>[...] Tunkelang noted some of the same issues to making search a utility and proposed two approaches to making Enterprise Search work.&#160; With Enterprise 2.0 changing [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Tunkelang noted some of the same issues to making search a utility and proposed two approaches to making Enterprise Search work.&nbsp; With Enterprise 2.0 changing [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Not Marching to Google&#8217;s Vision &#124; The Noisy Channel</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-395</link>
		<dc:creator>Not Marching to Google&#8217;s Vision &#124; The Noisy Channel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 02:14:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-395</guid>
		<description>[...] I&#8217;ll let other companies speak for themselves, but I can state with certainty that Endeca is not marching to Google&#8217;s vision. As I&#8217;ve discussed here repeatedly, enterprise search is not a problem that can be solved by just plugging a box into your intranet. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I&#8217;ll let other companies speak for themselves, but I can state with certainty that Endeca is not marching to Google&#8217;s vision. As I&#8217;ve discussed here repeatedly, enterprise search is not a problem that can be solved by just plugging a box into your intranet. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Tunkelang</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-25</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Tunkelang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 02:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-25</guid>
		<description>As for my statement about the nature of the web making it possible to quantify this user-independent relevance reasonably well, I mean two things.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;1) There is sufficient agreement about relevance as applied to typical web searches that it is at least approximately true to talk about user-independent relevance.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;2) The success of Google, Yahoo, and Microsoft at returning results that satisfy users show that this relevance function can be codified (even if each of these companies guards its formula as carefully as the &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coca-Cola_formula&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Coca-Cola formula&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As for my statement about the nature of the web making it possible to quantify this user-independent relevance reasonably well, I mean two things.</p>
<p>1) There is sufficient agreement about relevance as applied to typical web searches that it is at least approximately true to talk about user-independent relevance.</p>
<p>2) The success of Google, Yahoo, and Microsoft at returning results that satisfy users show that this relevance function can be codified (even if each of these companies guards its formula as carefully as the <a HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coca-Cola_formula" REL="nofollow">Coca-Cola formula</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Tunkelang</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-24</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Tunkelang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 02:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-24</guid>
		<description>I did find some statistics to justify my belief about the distribution of web search queries.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;According to a &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://www.sigir.org/forum/F2002/broder.pdf&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;study&lt;/a&gt; published by &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Broder&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Andrei Broder&lt;/a&gt; in 2002, navigational queries represent 26.4% of web search queries.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;According to a 2007 &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://aixtal.blogspot.com/2007/11/search-google-yahoo-comparison.html&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;study by Jean Véronis&lt;/a&gt;, 27% of Google searches and 31% of Yahoo searches return a Wikipedia result at their first link.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did find some statistics to justify my belief about the distribution of web search queries.</p>
<p>According to a <a HREF="http://www.sigir.org/forum/F2002/broder.pdf" REL="nofollow">study</a> published by <a HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrei_Broder" REL="nofollow">Andrei Broder</a> in 2002, navigational queries represent 26.4% of web search queries.</p>
<p>According to a 2007 <a HREF="http://aixtal.blogspot.com/2007/11/search-google-yahoo-comparison.html" REL="nofollow">study by Jean Véronis</a>, 27% of Google searches and 31% of Yahoo searches return a Wikipedia result at their first link.</p>
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		<title>By: fd</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-23</link>
		<dc:creator>fd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Apr 2008 15:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-23</guid>
		<description>Daniel, I think you brought up an important point.  An IR scenario is not defined by a corpus alone; that would be boring.  Rather, an IR scenario is defined by a corpus and the users entering the system.  The diversity of needs and search types suggest one place where we can distinguish IR tasks.  If the web were only known-item searches, we would have been &quot;done&quot; a long time ago.  The tail&#039;s pretty long and I-ahem-suspect that&#039;s where a lot of current web research is going on.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;FWIW, I did not understand &quot;Moreover, the nature of the web makes it possible to quantify this user-independent relevance reasonably well.&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daniel, I think you brought up an important point.  An IR scenario is not defined by a corpus alone; that would be boring.  Rather, an IR scenario is defined by a corpus and the users entering the system.  The diversity of needs and search types suggest one place where we can distinguish IR tasks.  If the web were only known-item searches, we would have been &#8220;done&#8221; a long time ago.  The tail&#8217;s pretty long and I-ahem-suspect that&#8217;s where a lot of current web research is going on.</p>
<p>FWIW, I did not understand &#8220;Moreover, the nature of the web makes it possible to quantify this user-independent relevance reasonably well.&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Omar Alonso</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-21</link>
		<dc:creator>Omar Alonso</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Apr 2008 21:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-21</guid>
		<description>Enterprise search is tough because the expectations in terms of relevance are difficult to achieve, in my opinion.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;As somebody who has worked on both camps (enterprise and internet search), the typical user expects a Google-like quality inside the company given his/her experience on the Web.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The problem is, it is unlikely that your business information need is  looking for a good hotel review for your next vacations. It is likely that is about a potential customer or competitor. And the answer is not a fact. Involves digesting and summarizing different things. Kind of sensemaking &amp; exploratory search.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;So maybe, one way to tackle the problem for enterprise search is to not use the Web search as a model, but something different.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Enterprise search is tough because the expectations in terms of relevance are difficult to achieve, in my opinion.</p>
<p>As somebody who has worked on both camps (enterprise and internet search), the typical user expects a Google-like quality inside the company given his/her experience on the Web.</p>
<p>The problem is, it is unlikely that your business information need is  looking for a good hotel review for your next vacations. It is likely that is about a potential customer or competitor. And the answer is not a fact. Involves digesting and summarizing different things. Kind of sensemaking &#038; exploratory search.</p>
<p>So maybe, one way to tackle the problem for enterprise search is to not use the Web search as a model, but something different.</p>
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		<title>By: Daniel Tunkelang</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-19</link>
		<dc:creator>Daniel Tunkelang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-19</guid>
		<description>Perhaps &quot;objective&quot; vs. &quot;subjective&quot; isn&#039;t the right dichotomy. There has been lots of progress on user modeling to personalize ranking. Nonetheless, I&#039;d rather the system be less clever and more predictable by giving me more control over the experience. Work by &lt;a HREF=&quot;http://citeseer.ist.psu.edu/koenemann96case.html&quot; REL=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Koenemann and Belkin&lt;/a&gt; suggests that others share my view.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;And, speaking of imperfect dichotomies, I concede that I&#039;m oversimplifying the distinction between web search and enterprise search. Let me try to add some nuance.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I don&#039;t have statistics handy, but I believe that a majority of web search queries are either navigational queries best answered by a home page or popular informational queries best answered by a Wikipedia page. At least for these queries, there is near-universal agreement on what constitutes the best result. Moreover, the nature of the web makes it possible to quantify this user-independent relevance reasonably well.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;How is enterprise search different? Part of the problem with characterizing enterprise search is that there really is no single characterization. There are known-item searches best answered by the enterprise analogs of home pages and Wikipedia pages. But the highest-value information needs in an enterprise are not known-item searches. Rather, they are scenarios where of searching for information to solve a problem without even the certainty that the information is available, or that the problem is framed correctly. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;As for searching using metadata vs. free text, that&#039;s a different--though very related--issue. At the risk of another oversimplification, I&#039;d say that free text suffices for most known-item information needs, while metadata is essential for most exploratory needs. And I agree that enterprises often benefit from more predictable and reliable metadata than the web at large.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;But my point here is not to try to articulate the differences between web data and enterprise data. Rather, I&#039;m asserting a general difference between the typical expectations / needs of web search and enterprise search users.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps &#8220;objective&#8221; vs. &#8220;subjective&#8221; isn&#8217;t the right dichotomy. There has been lots of progress on user modeling to personalize ranking. Nonetheless, I&#8217;d rather the system be less clever and more predictable by giving me more control over the experience. Work by <a HREF="http://citeseer.ist.psu.edu/koenemann96case.html" REL="nofollow">Koenemann and Belkin</a> suggests that others share my view.</p>
<p>And, speaking of imperfect dichotomies, I concede that I&#8217;m oversimplifying the distinction between web search and enterprise search. Let me try to add some nuance.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t have statistics handy, but I believe that a majority of web search queries are either navigational queries best answered by a home page or popular informational queries best answered by a Wikipedia page. At least for these queries, there is near-universal agreement on what constitutes the best result. Moreover, the nature of the web makes it possible to quantify this user-independent relevance reasonably well.</p>
<p>How is enterprise search different? Part of the problem with characterizing enterprise search is that there really is no single characterization. There are known-item searches best answered by the enterprise analogs of home pages and Wikipedia pages. But the highest-value information needs in an enterprise are not known-item searches. Rather, they are scenarios where of searching for information to solve a problem without even the certainty that the information is available, or that the problem is framed correctly. </p>
<p>As for searching using metadata vs. free text, that&#8217;s a different&#8211;though very related&#8211;issue. At the risk of another oversimplification, I&#8217;d say that free text suffices for most known-item information needs, while metadata is essential for most exploratory needs. And I agree that enterprises often benefit from more predictable and reliable metadata than the web at large.</p>
<p>But my point here is not to try to articulate the differences between web data and enterprise data. Rather, I&#8217;m asserting a general difference between the typical expectations / needs of web search and enterprise search users.</p>
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		<title>By: David Weinberger</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-17</link>
		<dc:creator>David Weinberger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Apr 2008 15:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-17</guid>
		<description>Don&#039;t we want both of the alternatives you end with? We want to be able to search by objective, controlled metadata such as department and date, and we want to search using far fuzzier semantics (&quot;What do you know about Japanese business-card protocol?&quot;). Both are ways we find relevant info, in the ordinary English meaning of &quot;relevant.&quot; (In that meaning, relevance is always relevant _to_  interests that usually aren&#039;t expressed in the query itself, which makes the objective/subjective dichotomy slippery.) Or have I missed your point?&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The difference between Web and enterprise search  would then be that because the enterprise  is a (semi-)closed system, the metadata is more predictable and reliable, and the interests can be assumed with greater confidence. &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;So, don&#039;t enterprises really want both of the alternatives? (This can be taken as a specification of the more general principle &quot;People want everything,&quot; which itself is a specification of the most general principle &quot;Those damn people!&quot; :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t we want both of the alternatives you end with? We want to be able to search by objective, controlled metadata such as department and date, and we want to search using far fuzzier semantics (&#8220;What do you know about Japanese business-card protocol?&#8221;). Both are ways we find relevant info, in the ordinary English meaning of &#8220;relevant.&#8221; (In that meaning, relevance is always relevant _to_  interests that usually aren&#8217;t expressed in the query itself, which makes the objective/subjective dichotomy slippery.) Or have I missed your point?</p>
<p>The difference between Web and enterprise search  would then be that because the enterprise  is a (semi-)closed system, the metadata is more predictable and reliable, and the interests can be assumed with greater confidence. </p>
<p>So, don&#8217;t enterprises really want both of the alternatives? (This can be taken as a specification of the more general principle &#8220;People want everything,&#8221; which itself is a specification of the most general principle &#8220;Those damn people!&#8221; <img src='http://thenoisychannel.com/wordpress/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: FD</title>
		<link>http://thenoisychannel.com/2008/04/12/can-search-be-a-utility/comment-page-1/#comment-13</link>
		<dc:creator>FD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Apr 2008 19:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thenoisychannel.com/?p=7#comment-13</guid>
		<description>This will be all over the place.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I think it&#039;s questionable to claim that web search currently views relevance as objective.  By virtue of increasingly finer-grained user and query modeling, relevance is becoming more subjective.  These methods are not yet at the sophistication of models in the library/information science community but are a move in that direction.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;That said, IR existed long before web search and I think it&#039;s dangerous to think situations different from web search are new situations for IR.  Seemingly new tasks and perspectives have often been quite well-studied in the IR and information/library  science literature.  I think the appropriate question is: &quot;does enterprise search have an analog in search for other corpora?&quot;  If not, what _precisely_ are the differences. The paragraph &quot;In the enterprise, however...addresses our needs&quot; is a little vague and makes enterprise search sound like QA.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;In conclusion, I agree with your general claim that search cannot be a utility.  IR consists of a set of design principles for solving search problems.  The appropriateness of a technique is very dependent on the search scenario and it is the role of the IR expert to make these decisions based on experience and published results.  If I need a bridge from San Francisco to Oakland, I won&#039;t plop a down the Ben Franklin bridge.  But I may call the engineer who built it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This will be all over the place.</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s questionable to claim that web search currently views relevance as objective.  By virtue of increasingly finer-grained user and query modeling, relevance is becoming more subjective.  These methods are not yet at the sophistication of models in the library/information science community but are a move in that direction.</p>
<p>That said, IR existed long before web search and I think it&#8217;s dangerous to think situations different from web search are new situations for IR.  Seemingly new tasks and perspectives have often been quite well-studied in the IR and information/library  science literature.  I think the appropriate question is: &#8220;does enterprise search have an analog in search for other corpora?&#8221;  If not, what _precisely_ are the differences. The paragraph &#8220;In the enterprise, however&#8230;addresses our needs&#8221; is a little vague and makes enterprise search sound like QA.</p>
<p>In conclusion, I agree with your general claim that search cannot be a utility.  IR consists of a set of design principles for solving search problems.  The appropriateness of a technique is very dependent on the search scenario and it is the role of the IR expert to make these decisions based on experience and published results.  If I need a bridge from San Francisco to Oakland, I won&#8217;t plop a down the Ben Franklin bridge.  But I may call the engineer who built it.</p>
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